I think Trump is a usurper too, but that doesn’t mean he didn’t win. The way I see it is having valid goals disallowed and a biased ref doesn’t change the result on the scoreboard.

Legally, he is president.

There isn’t a day that goes by that I don’t question the opinions I hear or read.

Podesta’s e-mails were his private ones.

What about Trump’s tax returns, and his campaign e-mails.

I didn’t day that’s how Hillary Clinton got rich, I was just countering your narrative that she’s all bad.

And stop bringing her husband into it. He wasn’t running for office. I don’t bring up Melania, or Trump’s children.

As for being open-minded, you can’t even admit to the possibility that your God might not be real, despite there being absolutely no proof whatsoever for His existence. That’s not open-minded imo.

Lamestream media bias is a matter of empirical fact. It’s obvious and predictable. When was the last time you put down a newspaper or swtched off a TV channel holding any doubt as to the opinions, values and partisan leanings of that outlet’s management and personnel? When was the last time the news columns of the New York Times did not hew tightly to Democrat and other far-left talking points? What is the likelihood that anything will be different in ten years?

Hate to be the one to break it to you, but the Clintons didn’t get stinking rich by helping the downtrodden. And Hillary sure didn’t pass up a lucrative partnership at a well-connected corporate law firm–indeed she spent nearly 20 years there trading on her connections. Many of the scandals that earned her a reputation for conniving and paranoia lead right back to the Rose Law Firm.

Hillary’s record at State is just one debacle after another: Egypt; Libya; Syria; Iran; the treacherous abandonment of Iraq and consequent rise of ISIS. She lied about the murder of an ambassador (“What difference does it make?”). And that’s just one region!

Hackers targeted the RNC’s systems but failed to breach them. (Leaving your front door unlocked doesn’t give anybody the right to rob you–but it sure as heck means I’m not going to trust you with my house!)

(That being said, BTW, why aren’t campaign files considered public records? That would be a reform with some teeth.)

There’s no mystery about how Trump won: He ran an unpredictable campaign against utterly predictable opponents.

And finally, for the record, yours truly is the most open-minded person ever!

@Heather,
“Trump won the election. I’m not denying that and haven’t ever said otherwise.”
With all due respect, I think you are wrong there. The evidence clearly points to stolen elections, as pointed out above (and note I did not mention Russian interference, I do not think it is nescessary to come to that conclusion).
I think Trump is an usurper.

67% of Republicans support
22% of Independents support
8% of Democrats support

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/energy-environment/wp/2017/06/05/post-abc-poll-nearly-6-in-10-oppose-trump-scrapping-paris-agreement/?pushid=5935ac802e12651d00000039&tid=notifi_push_breaking-news&utm_term=.a9a610427f1b

The media seems biased to you because you don’t have an open mind. You require agreement to assume lack of bias. I don’t.

Clinton worked for many years as a lawyer, working for the poor and under-served. She had the results and offers to work for a corporate firm but chose not to. Then she worked for free for her husband’s state, then later for her country as an excellent secretary if state. There was also a lot of charity work, and not just for her husband’s charity. Trump’s charity paid for huge portraits of himself and fines his golf courses incurred. It lost its status as a charity because of fraudulent dealings.

There are multiple reports of Trump ripping off those who did work for him. Many people have lost their livelihoods because of his dishonest business practices. He’s a thoroughly repellent character.

The Republican party was hacked too. It’s just that the Russians chose not to leak what they found there. I do not deny, and have never denied, that the DNC did not adequately protect their information. However, that is not a valid excuse or justification for stealing their information. That’s blaming the victim for wearing a short skirt.

Trump won the election. I’m not denying that and haven’t ever said otherwise. How he won it I think is the question. I don’t know whether he or anyone on his team colluded with what the Russians did, but I think that needs to be discovered. Comey’s actions I think were the result of bad decisions on his part. I think he thought Clinton would win, which is why he talked about her. He didn’t talk about the Trump investigation because he thought Trump would lose and Trump would never be anything other than a private citizen. Obama didn’t talk about the Russian interference because he didn’t want it said he was interfering on Clinton’s behalf – he thought she would win without it being mentioned. Comey was honourable but he had a need to be seen to be doing the right thing in an unprecedented situation. He made the wrong decision, which may have been unconsciously influenced by his Republicanism but was not deliberately anti-Clinton.

The parochial American strikes again.

@HH: By all means, knock yourself out getting Mike Pence a promotion. I’m all for that. But neither of us should get our hopes up.

Trump earned his success by building stuff, meeting a need, getting stuff done and creating value. Clinton got filthy rich without ever once performing an honest day’s work. She never built anything, sold anything, accomplished anything of tangible value, or signed the front of a paycheck. She’s mooched off of taxpayers almost all her adult life. So no, there’s no comparison. And no, “honest” is not a word that can be squeezed into the same paragraph with Bill or Hillary Clinton, the sleaziest duo in the annals of sleaze.

The DNC and Podesta e-mails were hacked because they were incompetently secured. That’s no one else’s fault. Sunshine is the best disinfectant. If voters didn’t like what they learned, so be it.

If the lamestream media seems unbiased to you, it’s because their partisan bias and yours happen to align. Nor is there such a thing as a “nonpartisan fact-checker”.

Whine yourself hoarse about the outcome, but the election is ancient history by now. The GOP will control the White House at least until January 2021, and they will move forward with a reform agenda. Meanwhile the Democrat-Left remains stubbornly out of touch (as evidenced by many of the comments on this page).

Well, with the present electon fraud, it appears a Dem candidate needs anout 5 to 10 million more of the popular votes to overcome the fraud (like Obama did). HRC’s 2 to 3 million proved insufficient.
I think, as far as counting goes, a bipartisan overseeing should be mandatory in a real democracy.
Yes, those 4%. I just hope the Dems will not count on it, but keep going at grassroot level. ( https://www.indivisibleguide.com )

Heather, that last comment was worthy of another post. Good job.
I think I can tie some of what you say there together. The hatred of Hillary and the worship of Trump comes from the least educated and most highly religious voters. This segment of society has done poorly economically and lack social status. They are not college educated. They do not read books. They are deeply, deeply, resentful and afraid. They resent and despise the experts, the intelligentsia, the professionals, and the middle class who have done well. They have almost no savings as they move into retirement and depend on social security almost exclusively to get by. They are at the mercy of banks, doctors, dentists, and hospitals. They feel disappointed after the promise of the American Dream turned to ashes. To them, Hillary represents the class of Americans who bypassed them on the social ladder. Her slightest infraction became cause for ridicule. Trump, on the other hand, spoke their language. He acts like some boorish turd who could almost be a part of their family. Crude and of low manner. Just the sort of classless person who’s more than willing to laugh with them at any of Hillary’s missteps and cheer Trump’s most vile statements. Trump can stick his thumb in your eye (he almost literally did it when he plowed to the front of the group of dignitaries during his European visit).
The religious aspect has been discussed on Jerry’s forum. The Trump voting class are highly religious because of the insecurity for them of life in America. The social safety net is always just a republican vote away from from being repealed. This is a contradiction, I know. How can people, even if they love Trump and hate Hillary vote for someone backed by the Koch brothers who seek to destroy FDR’s legacy? Well, it happened just that way.