In November last year Gallup did a survey on healthcare. Among other things it found that 51% of USians thought providing healthcare was a government responsibility. Clearly there is a shift in the mood of the country. The results can be found here http://www.gallup.com/opinion/polling-matters/196814/gallup-review-healthcare-election.aspx?utm_source=alert&utm_medium=email&utm_content=morelink&utm_campaign=syndication

During the Bush presidency, the result was as high as 69%. It seems to me that GOP campaigning against Obamacare has depressed the view that healthcare provision is a government responsibility.

The survey also shows that USians have a very negative view of their healthcare industry.

More than happy to let Heather’s readers decide that.

We’ll have to agree to disagree as to the source of the malarkey and who’s dutifully handling cleanup.

You’re very mistaken to think I’m trying to convince you of anything. I counter your shit, because in a public forum, shit shouldn’t go unchallenged.

The word quality has multiple senses. You describe performance against standards, and that certainly is one meaning of the word. However, the word also refers to the standards themselves. For example, does the “right to quality health care” mean that everyone is entitled to the latest “gold standard” drug or therapy? What if last year’s “gold standard” is good enough — at one-tenth the cost? And if I the patient am not actually entitled to the same standard that someone else receives, then in what sense is it a “right”?

Again, that’s a false choice: socialism or suffering. Socialism doesn’t end suffering; it just spreads it around.

Not counting veterans, the disabled, and Obamacare subsidies, US taxpayers provide free medical coverage to over a third of the total population. Perhaps we can find a more deserving target for the horror and disgust. For instance, isn’t it disgusting to say that only one’s countrymen, and not people in the developing world, have a basic human right?

@Ken: If we can agree on which results are “good” and which are “bad” (hard to do without resorting to ideology), and you can cite repeatable controlled experiments to substantiate your argument (and not just meaningless cherry-picked data), then by all means be my guest.

@Heather: Uh, no. Migration between the USA and the countries you mention is overwhelmingly lopsided in one direction. (And that’s in absolute numbers, disregarding the USA’s much larger population base.) For instance, about 40% more New Zealand emigrants live in the USA than vice versa (notwithstanding the fact that the overall population ratio is about 70:1).

The tired, the poor, the wretched — some might say deplorable — from the ends of the earth, all yearning to BREATHE FREE, still stream through the golden door.

People also want to come to the US regardless of how bad the president is, but you’d never argue we therefore shouldn’t be concerned about who is president. As for universal health care provision leading to worse results, the facts simply show this to be a baldfaced lie. You don’t have a logical argument, only blind ideology that doesn’t fit with reality.

There are a lot of USians looking to emigrate to the UK, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand. The “huddled masses” are coming from countries even worse than the US. It’s simply easier to gain illegal entry there than those countries above.

I’m not sure being a more attractive place to live than Guatemala is the best advertisement.